Pakistan Gets F16 -Blk70/72

[Ertugral]

I am now really confused.... we have delivered Afghan deal to the Americans on a platter and yet we are not seeing any reciprocity from them. What else they want us to do. Don’t tell me they want guarantee to move all their equipment out through Pakistan before they pay our CSF.
They still have not paid for damaging our highways yet.

I heard from one source that US contractors are already in Pak to upgrade the infra for future tech. Absorption...I don't know is it for Zulus or 16. @Khafee can you plz endorsed or deny?

 

[space cadet]

Was planning a visit there this summer...

I would bet they aren't doing the boneyard tours anymore

 

[Khafee]

I heard from one source that US contractors are already in Pak to upgrade the infra for future tech. Absorption...I don't know is it for Zulus or 16. @Khafee can you plz endorsed or deny?

Both are coming IA, On the Vipers the numbers are not confirmed. On the Zulus they are.

 

[Zeeman]

With Modi like a snake with tail cut off right now we need those Zulus NOW.

 

[Khafee]

With Modi like a snake with tail cut off right now we need those Zulus NOW.

What is the next option?

 

[Zeeman]

I really am not a big fan of Chinese choppers .... underpowered and not combat proven. We need something to compete in anti armour warfare. AH64 and Rafael give me the real reason to worry .

 

[Cookie Monster]

What is the next option?

I still think that Modi or India in general under whoever would not want to risk a full scale war. Their economy has already taken a hit...and a full scale war would decimate it.

Pak on the other hand has also taken an economic hit...but Pak's economy was performing poorly anyways(definitely not as good as India was doing). Hence India has more to lose. A few skirmishes here and there are more likely for chest thumping and to divert attention of their citizens from domestic problems.

I could be wrong of course as no one can predict the future with certainty. However I would proceed based on that conclusion above...and instead plan for Pak's helicopter needs(for all three branches and for civilian purposes as well) in the long run. If Zulus come with CSF that's even better...it's a freebie that helps plug some gaps...but the main focus would be to partner up with Turkey(or China, Ukraine, or whoever is willing to go with full ToT). Create a JV like that of JF17 and kickstart Pak's rotorcraft industry. Focus on building 3 types of helicopters (light, medium, heavy) with their corresponding engines. Then in hopefully next 15 years...Pak would be producing its own.

It may seem like we r lacking behind our adversary...but I think it would be the best course of action. This investment would more than pay for itself.

 

[Ertugral]

I really am not a big fan of Chinese choppers .... underpowered and not combat proven. We need something to compete in anti armour warfare. AH64 and Rafael give me the real reason to worry .

We'll add S-400 to that list, but the counter is available not the same items though...for eg choppers can be countered by Pantsirs and new Iglas with 7km range. rafale can be with block 70s and S-400 with Stand off weapons or drone swarms etc. Though we should procure Z-10s initially and wait for the Zulus...Z-10 ME with improvents can be quite handful apart from High altitude engagements.

 

[Gripen9]

I would bet they aren't doing the boneyard tours anymore

Yeah unfortunately plans have been shelved

 

[Mingle]

I really am not a big fan of Chinese choppers .... underpowered and not combat proven. We need something to compete in anti armour warfare. AH64 and Rafael give me the real reason to worry .

If line is clear and US in good mood Pak should lobby for AH64s along zulus.

 

[Pakhtoon yum]

[

I still think that Modi or India in general under whoever would not want to risk a full scale war. Their economy has already taken a hit...and a full scale war would decimate it.

Pak on the other hand has also taken an economic hit...but Pak's economy was performing poorly anyways(definitely not as good as India was doing). Hence India has more to lose. A few skirmishes here and there are more likely for chest thumping and to divert attention of their citizens from domestic problems.

I could be wrong of course as no one can predict the future with certainty. However I would proceed based on that conclusion above...and instead plan for Pak's helicopter needs(for all three branches and for civilian purposes as well) in the long run. If Zulus come with CSF that's even better...it's a freebie that helps plug some gaps...but the main focus would be to partner up with Turkey(or China, Ukraine, or whoever is willing to go with full ToT). Create a JV like that of JF17 and kickstart Pak's rotorcraft industry. Focus on building 3 types of helicopters (light, medium, heavy) with their corresponding engines. Then in hopefully next 15 years...Pak would be producing its own.

It may seem like we r lacking behind our adversary...but I think it would be the best course of action. This investment would more than pay for itself.

I'm more worried about the rise of insurgency again. In balochistan and now the police in KP giving warnings to the government and army but like always the government and army has its head up its a**.

I don't want them to take over a place for then to finally realise that the real threat is afganistan. Or form them to kill hundreds of pur children again. Shame on this army chief and IK.

Give the FC an open hand to raid Afghanistan. If we keep cutting the branches then the tree would keep producing more. Target the roots in Afghanistan. Those terrorist camps need to be raided and burnt to the ground

 

[Cookie Monster]

[

I'm more worried about the rise of insurgency again. In balochistan and now the police in KP giving warnings to the government and army but like always the government and army has its head up its a**.

I don't want them to take over a place for then to finally realise that the real threat is afganistan. Or form them to kill hundreds of pur children again. Shame on this army chief and IK.

Give the FC an open hand to raid Afghanistan. If we keep cutting the branches then the tree would keep producing more. Target the roots in Afghanistan. Those terrorist camps need to be raided and burnt to the ground

The insurgency can be addressed in two ways...
1) Final push for peace in Afghanistan...that sees a complete withdrawal of foreign troops and part of that should be a push to secure as much power as possible for Afghan Taliban(forming the new government).
--> The Afghan Taliban are pro Pak...and they have tribal relations with Pak's Pukhtoons. It wouldn't be hard to keep them pro Pak.
--> Once foreign troops are gone and Afghan Taliban are in power...it will be open hunting season for any Indian sponsored...or any anti Pak elements in general that are operating from Afghanistan.

2) In addition continued efforts should be made to complete fencing of the border with Afghanistan and Iran...with only a few check points through which trade and travel occurs.
--> Besides fences...install sensors to monitor the border day/night.
--> Use UAV...and UCAVs if attacks are to be carried out. This coupled with ground troops(FC) would make it immensely hard for the likes of TTP or BLA to move in and out of Pak...or to coordinate attacks, smuggle in weapons, etc.

As for shaming IK and the Army chief for not openly carrying out ops in Afganistan. U must understand there are consequences. It's not that Pak is incapable of it. The consequences are of image. India has been working hard for a while now doing propaganda to paint Pak as the cause of Afghan civil war and instability...which to an extent has worked to malign Pak's image. Any military action directly taken by Pak forces on their soil...and it would add credibility to Indian lies. It's the last mile...let's not get desperate...slow and steady wins the race.

 

[Mastankhan]

I am now really confused.... we have delivered Afghan deal to the Americans on a platter and yet we are not seeing any reciprocity from them. What else they want us to do. Don’t tell me they want guarantee to move all their equipment out through Pakistan before they pay our CSF.
They still have not paid for damaging our highways yet.

Hi,

Pakistan has learnt nothing out of this war---. You never do the deal for the US unless you get what you need on your ground---.

The americans have no honor left to fulfil the deal---they can do about face anytime they want to---.

 

[Pakhtoon yum]

The insurgency can be addressed in two ways...
1) Final push for peace in Afghanistan...that sees a complete withdrawal of foreign troops and part of that should be a push to secure as much power as possible for Afghan Taliban(forming the new government).
--> The Afghan Taliban are pro Pak...and they have tribal relations with Pak's Pukhtoons. It wouldn't be hard to keep them pro Pak.
--> Once foreign troops are gone and Afghan Taliban are in power...it will be open hunting season for any Indian sponsored...or any anti Pak elements in general that are operating from Afghanistan.

2) In addition continued efforts should be made to complete fencing of the border with Afghanistan and Iran...with only a few check points through which trade and travel occurs.
--> Besides fences...install sensors to monitor the border day/night.
--> Use UAV...and UCAVs if attacks are to be carried out. This coupled with ground troops(FC) would make it immensely hard for the likes of TTP or BLA to move in and out of Pak...or to coordinate attacks, smuggle in weapons, etc.

As for shaming IK and the Army chief for not openly carrying out ops in Afganistan. U must understand there are consequences. It's not that Pak is incapable of it. The consequences are of image. India has been working hard for a while now doing propaganda to paint Pak as the cause of Afghan civil war and instability...which to an extent has worked to malign Pak's image. Any military action directly taken by Pak forces on their soil...and it would add credibility to Indian lies. It's the last mile...let's not get desperate...slow and steady wins the race.

No, I do understand the nasty truths to "why". I just tend to get emotional because it's the pakhtoons, balochs and anyone on the frontiers that bare the blunt of terrorism. I've lost family and dare friends in this war. Its very near my heart so I lash out when I see incompetence. They are showing incompetence though. If they cant leave the borders then atleast protect what's within them.

 

[Cookie Monster]

No, I do understand the nasty truths to "why". I just tend to get emotional because it's the pakhtoons, balochs and anyone on the frontiers that bare the blunt of terrorism. I've lost family and dare friends in this war. Its very near my heart so I lash out when I see incompetence. They are showing incompetence though. If they cant leave the borders then atleast protect what's within them.

I can understand the emotions...but u must be able to compartmentalize and step back...and look at the bigger picture.