Shiaism dissected

[Berke2]

Asalaamualaykum. Some of you may have read my posts where I complain about being banned on pakistani platforms for posting about shiaism or taking the mick out of iran's corona virus response. I can criticise the government, other people, the army but not this one thing because some moderator tends to be one of them, It ticks me off to no end. After my latest platform ban for the iran thing by someone who I'm sure is probably a member of a certain sect, I have to decided to stop holding back what I know and say what I want. I hate that I get banned for saying the truth or posting a meme, I hate twelver shiaism the belief system and lastly I hate it when many fellow Muslims think shiaism is A-okay. Now that's a lot of hate right there and you may be thinking that this guy is a wacky extremist but I assure you I am not. So follow this and watch how I change your mind insha'Allah. I will use nothing more than my keyboard and words of shias themselves. And I'm not just doing it on here, I'm going to do this on several websites and platforms. Sometimes I will post short videos, sometimes I will extracts from books or websites.

Any shia is welcome to come and try and try to prove anything I posted as being false.

Aim of this thread:

1) Theologically challenge shiaism, specifically twelver shiaism
2) Make shias question their beliefs, their hadith books, their scholars
3) Educate sunnis on what type of things Iran actually teaches it's people and then exports to other countries

This is every shia mod whose ever banned me after they learn of my decision (okay just kidding, more serious posts below tho):

 

[Berke2]

Have you ever heard shias voice their hatred for takfiris especially using the phrase "takfiri wahabi" unfairly in arguments? Well guess what, they have no leg to stand on. Meet ayotollah Husayn Ansariyan from Iran who tells you exactly what he thinks of sunnis and btw this guy is a respected ayotollah, he is not considered an extremist amongst shia, in fact they advertise his books on one of the most popular shia websites online... Turn english subs on btw.

 

[Berke2]

I recently got banned for saying shiaism has shirk in it. Meet someone who supports my view - grand ayotollah Khomeini. The leader of the iranian revolution, Khamenei's predecessor and heavyweight scholar of shias. Let's read some of his words. A webpage from the Iranian based www.Imam-Khomeini.com Pro-Khomeini propaganda website run by the IslamicThought Foundation (ITF) in Tehran states the following:

.. لم تكن امرأة عادية، بل هي كائن ملكوتي تجلّى في الوجود بصورة إنسان، بل كائن إلهي جبروتي ظهر على هيئة امرأة. إنها المرأة التي تتحلى بجميع خصال الأنبياء.. المرأة التي لو كانت رجلاً لكانت نبياً … لو كانت رجلاً لكانت بمقام رسول الله
حوار مع فضل الله حول الزهراء ع – السيد هاشم الهاشمي
The status of [Fatimah] Al-Zahra (as) in the words of Imam Khomeini:
‘[Fatimah) wasn’t an ordinary woman, she was rather an angelic being that manifested itself in the form of an human being*. In fact,* she was a divine and omnipotent being that [merely] appeared in the form of a woman … Indeed, all qualities of all Prophets are found in her … A woman, if born as a man, would have been a Prophet … and if born as a man would have reached the status of the Messenger of Allah … [Khomeini’s speech on ‘Women’s Day’ 16/05/1989]

This is taken from shiascans.com

How can someone of such high authority believe and say such things? The language is very extreme and exaggerated about Fatima (ra). Do these people love the family of the Prophet (pbuh) or do they attribute the characteristics of Allah unto his creation? It is something that people who say sem2sem for shiaism and Islam need to ask themselves. If I said to you, who is an omnipotent being? We all know the answer and the answer is Allah. But it seems that Khomeini didn't think that that was the answer.

 

[Berke2]

Ziarat ashura - the popular shia dua which includes cursing of Abu bakr (ra), Umar (ra), Uthman (ra), amongst many other people

This dua is very long, so press crtl + F and search for the words "first" "second" and "third" in the article below:

The translation is on this link - Ashura 2019: What is the Ziyarat Ashura prayer? English translation It's funny how a western website decided to paste a translation and make an article for ashura, poor guys don't even know that someone could potentially report them for posting a highly sectarian prayer.

This is one part of the dua I want to highlight:

O’ Allah! Particularly removal of mercy the first tyrant, a removal of mercy from me, and begin the first removal of mercy with him and then send the removal of mercy on the second and the third and then the forth (tyrant). O’ Allah removal of mercy Yazid, the fifth (tyrant) and removal of mercy ‘Ubaydullah b. Ziyad and Ibne Marjanah and ‘‘Umar b. Sa’d and Shimr and the family of Sufyan and the family of Ziyad and the family of Marwan until the day of Judgement.

Now who are the first, second and third? The one's being cursed but not mentioned by name. They are Abu bakr, Umar and Uthman (may Allah be pleased with them all). They mention a fouth aswell and I'm pretty sure that's Muawiya (ra) even though at other points they're cursing him by name. This dua is commonly read, it's also read in pilgrimages to the shrine in karbala.The majority of shia accept this dua.
Now shias will say that they don't know who exactly is the first second or third are or that they mean something else like the first is the son of Adam (as) who committed murder etc... But that's lies, I have two proofs to back me up:

1. r/shia comment about ziarat ashura which confirms the names
2. one is confirmation by Ammar Nakshwani where he heavily implies that the names are not mentioned due to taqiyyah and whose identity it's masking. An ex-shia made this video so don't think it's me writing the commentary.

 

[Berke2]

Why the Iranian ayotollahs can't quarantine the city of Qom, it would mean rejecting their religion

Looks like calamity befalling because they can't stop themselves from going to qom which is the epicentre of virus outbreak...

 

[Scorpion]

Shiism was never a religious movement. It started as a political movement that later was converted into a mixture of politics and religion to increase political influence using religion during the Abbasid Caliphate. Its aim was to overthrow the Abbasid rule over Persia in the 900s when they established the Buyid dynasty.

Shia themselves do not know the history and the Shia elite in Iran deliberately do not teach this in school.

 

[Berke2]

Shiism was never a religious movement. It started as a political movement that later was converted into a mixture of politics and religion to increase political influence using religion during the Abbasid Caliphate. Its aim was to overthrow the Abbasid rule over Persia in the 900s when they established the Buyid dynasty.

Shia themselves do not know the history and the Shia elite in Iran deliberately do not teach this in school.

Did you know that once iranian ayotollah took 200 of their best students for umrah, 30 of the students came back with their belief in shiaism badly doubted because the student sat and ate with "wahaabis" who challenged them on their beliefs. The ayotollah went on to comment that in future the students should be prevented from sitting and talking with "wahaabis". Theres a video of the ayotollah explaining this, if I find it then I will post it insha'Allah.

 

[Falcon29]

Sunni scholars need to address two things, the ahadeeth Shia use and why they're considered inauthentic/fabricated, and also details of the lives of those figures Shia claim to follow and use as reference for their teachings. Because Shia's rely on these figures to suggest that people descending from the Prophet were not treated well and they also use these ahadeeth were they claim these figures did not like Abu Bakr, Umar and others.

Me, personally, I have read about Shia claims, but when I read their hadeeths they come off as fake and as if someone or a group of people with an agenda wanted to create their own religion. In which they move people from focus on God and instead focus on Ahl Al Bayt, in order to have people become attached to this way since it is more interesting and less boring(at least to most humans sadly) than traditional worship, to gain influence. And also it seemed to praise Iran as holy place and switch holy sites to places in Iraq and Iran. Their hadeeths have a very pro-Persian tilt, and then their beliefs are out of the ordinary.

For example, they believe they can have a connection to their Imam Al Mahdi and they need to become more devout to get closer to him. And they believe he can visit them and help them in their personal lives. Which is very bizarre and is shirk, and they are substituting him with God. There is also no evidence of their Imam Mahdi that went into occultation according to them.

So I do not look at the political dispute much, I don't believe humans are perfect like God, and especially Arabs had disputes even during time of Sahaba. Yet people in the Middle East today, if they compared their era to era after Prophet's death, it was still a lot better than what there is today, so why do they pretend it should be impossible for early Muslims to have disputes?

But for me personally, I don't 'love' anyone(human beings wise) I never met in my life except the Prophet Mohammed(SAW) as he is the example you want to follow and when I read his statements in the ahadeeth I highly respect him and feel affection for him, and it's as if he was with us today when he advised us on the end times and what kind of behaviors will arise and how we should avoid going astray. I highly respect other Sahaba(ones related to Prophet too) but I'm gonna say I love people in the way Shia say they love people. Because it's fake and not real love. For Shia it's a screw you Sunni's , we Iranians own this religion. That's the impression I get when they say they love Ahl Albayt.

 

[Falcon29]

It's more like they hate Islam and Muslims for toppling their empire. It's not possible and not in our fitrah to obsess over people. We are supposed to love and think about God and not people. This is why when you see them say we love Ahl Albayt it's not real and comes off as very fake. So they have to bring out emotions another way, either by hitting themselves or cursing Sahaba and also trying to spread their political movement among Sunni Muslims.

So the modern Shiasm is really weird and becoming more like a product of culture cult. I see some of them in my area put tattoos about Ahl Al Bayt and having stickers of their depictions of Hassan or Hussein on their cars and what not. Apparently people think that is love. That is not love.

Love should be for God, and love is not expressed the way humans today want to express it. With meaningless gestures, chants, and pictures. If you love God you need to prove it by where your heart stands over a long period of time, and prove it by your actions. And prove it to God and no one else. By believing in him and obeying his commandments. Abstain from major sins, abstain from getting into drama, abstain from becoming too attached to socializing and making like all about enjoyment. This is how you show love to God and how you get God to love you back. It's very hard and not easy.

Most people cannot avoid major sins like premarital sex and so on. Yet they want to push this 'love people instead of trying to obey the Lord' stuff on us.

I have, however met Shia people that aren't like that and do focus on God mostly. And I met one older Lebanese Shia man who seemed very like us Palestinians and was quite a righteous man who was focused on God completely. It's the Iranian ones that have more bizarre beliefs. Which is not a surprise since Iranian regime wants to breakdown Muslim societies to try to assume influence from within through soft power.

 

[Falcon29]

Also understand these disputes will continue and we can coexist. Otherwise we should focus on God and the Quran and 5 pillars and what not. Other matters we may not get definitive answers for.

 

[!eon]

Also understand these disputes will continue and we can coexist. Otherwise we should focus on God and the Quran and 5 pillars and what not. Other matters we may not get definitive answers for.

How can you coexist ?
Iran wants its hold in all Muslim countries where even minor shia population exists. They openly say they want control of Hijaz.
In Pakistan for example, they have movement "Thareek e nafaz e fiqa Jafria Pakistan" (Movement of implementation of shia laws in whole Pakistan)
They are certainly planning and preparing a military action, that's not hidden any more.

 

[Falcon29]

How can you coexist ?
Iran wants its hold in all Muslim countries where even minor shia population exists. They openly say they want control of Hijaz.
In Pakistan for example, they have movement "Thareek e nafaz e fiqa Jafria Pakistan" (Movement of implementation of shia laws in whole Pakistan)
They are certainly planning and preparing a military action, that's not hidden any more.

Not with Iran but just normal Shia and Sunni's together. I agree Iranian regime is big problem and biggest catalyst in causing divisions between Shia and Sunni Muslims and they need to be dealt with.

 

[Berke2]

Not with Iran but just normal Shia and Sunni's together. I agree Iranian regime is big problem and biggest catalyst in causing divisions between Shia and Sunni Muslims and they need to be dealt with.

To be fair bro, most normal shias support Iran in it's quest. I have tried to make excuses for them before I can't do that anymore. The only shia who I tend to get along with is either irreligious ones or one's who rarely talk about religion. The pakistani shia community is hugely loyal to Iran. Not all people but most people. I don't think Iran's the catalyst, I think twelver shiaism itself is the catalyst. It was twelver shiaism which led shias to betray baghdad to the mongols and which led saffavids to heavily oppress/force convert the sunnis of Iran to shiaism and now it's twelver shiaism which produces oppressors like these current ayotollahs.

 

[Berke2]

This next thing is something I believe all sunnis should be aware of. @starlord @BATMAN @Scorpion @Falcon29 @!eon

Ever tried to tell people that shias curse sahaba (ra) but then some shia comes and gives khamenei's fatwa where he said don't curse companions? Khamenei is doing taqiyya, that fatwa is just for sunni eyes and ears, most shia know it's scam for political gain. Look at what his predecessor ayotollah Khomeini says about Aisha, Talha (ra), Zubayr (ra) and Muwaiyah (ra).

And this is disgusting, I automatically say astaghfirullah when I read it, that's how bad it is. Khomeini, in his book - kitab al tahara, says that's our mother Aisha (ra) and the other 3 companions mentioned above "are more impure than dogs and pigs". And I can provide proof that he said this:

Firstly you can see the original source here at كتاب الطهارة - السيد الخميني - ج ٣ - الصفحة ٣٣٧

Translations below from Khomeini the Heretic & Enemy of Islam

Arabic original:
کتاب الطهارة – ج 3 – ص 457
وأما سائر الطوائف من النصاب بل الخوارج، فلا دليل على نجاستهم وإن كانوا أشد عذابا من الكفار، فلو خرج سلطان على أمير المؤمنين لا بعنوان التدين، بل للمعارضة في الملك، أو غرض أخر كعائشة والزبير وطلحة ومعاوية وأشباههم أو نصب احد عداوة له أو لأحد من الأئمة ع لا بعنوان التدين بل لعداوة قريش أو بني هاشم أو العرب أو لأجل كونه قاتل ولده أو أبيه أو غير ذلك لا يوجب – ظاهرا- شيء منها نجاسة ظاهرية وإن كانوا أخبث من الكلاب والخنازير…

Farsi:
و اما باقی گروه های ناصبی بلکه خوارج ، اگرچه عذابشان از کفار شدیدتر است ، اما دلیلی بر نجاست آنها نیست . بنابراین اگر سلطانی بر امیرالمومنین علیه السلام خروج کند ، نه به عنوان تدین بلکه به جهت مخالفت در ملک ، یا غرضی دیگر ، مانند عایشه و زبیر و طلحه و معاویه و مانند آنان ، یا شخصی با ایشان یا یکی از ائمه نه به عنوان تدین بلکه به جهت دشمنی قریش یا بنی هاشم یا عرب یا به دلیل اینکه ایشان قاتل فرزند یا پدرش است و…دشمنی داشته باشد ، ظاهرا هیچ یک از اینها موجب نجاست ظاهری نخواهد شد ، اگرچه اینها از سگ و خوک نیز خبیث تر هستند .

English translation:
Kitab Al Tahara of Ayatollah Khomeini – Vol. 3, page 457
As for the other groups of the Nawasib, actually the Khawarij, even though they’ll get the more punished then the Kuffar, yet this is not proving them to be Najis (impure). Hence if a Sultan makes Khurooj (opposes/fights) Amir Al-Mu’minin – ‘alaihis-salam – not for religious reason, rather for worldly reason (seeking power) or other motives like Aaisha, Zubair, Talha, Mu’aawiya and their likes, or if someone holds Nasb/enmity towards him or one of the [twelve] Imams (ع), not due to religious reason rather because of his enmity towards the Quraish, or Bani Hashim or the Arabs or because [Ali] killed one of his children or his father etc. Apparently none of those are necessarily considered Najis (impure) from an apparent point of view, although in fact they are more impure than dogs and pigs.

 

[Berke2]

Did you know that there is a belief in shiaism where they think the Qur'an has been distorted (tahreef)? It is actually a belief which they have a difference of opinion on. Some of their big scholars of the past have believed that the Qur'an has been distorted, I will be covering this in future insha'Allah. But for now, this video by grand ayotollah Kamal Haydari wil suffice, he resides in Qom in Iran:

*Turn english subs on guys*